BOC Bogie connection?

[Ted O. Jackson]

John sez:

> Well, sometimes we have to learn the hard way that people we look up to
> for a certain ability, whether it's playing a guitar, dunking a basketball,
> or make us laugh 'til our sides ache ... are NOT necessarily people we
> should somehow expect to somehow be great PEOPLE.  Appreciate the people
> for what they do, but don't expect that who they are is someone you should
> try to be.  You think someone like Buck Dharma wants people to emulate
> his lifestyle, habits, personal beliefs, etc. just 'cuz they like the way
> he can play a guitar?  He's famous for being a great guitarist, not a
> model citizen or a great humanitarian.  BTW, I'm not trying to imply that

HUmphrey Bogart once said:  the only thing I owe to my fans is my
best performance' meaning that he didn't feel a need to sign
autographs, make public appearances etc.  For him it was a privacy
thing, but I can see parallels to BOC as well.  It simply makes our
admiration more palatable if we think that someone we admire is also
a good person.  It makes us uncomfortable to think that we like
someone who hasn't behaved honorably--sort of a reflection upon
ourselves, I guess.

> ANYONE in BOC is an asshole - maybe they are, and maybe they aren't, I'm
> just using Buck as an example.  And I agree with Theo that I my opinions
> of them as musicians, and my ability to appreciate their music is
> seperate from my opinions of them as people.  How many of us try and "get
> to know" an artist on some personal level before we are willing to listen
> to and buy their music?  Hey, if I like the music, I'm gonna listen to
> it, and I sure as hell don't have time or the resources to find out
if
> the artist in question has similar beliefs, morals, personal habits, etc.
> as myself.
>
> >The way I see it, they're paying a Coleridgian price for
> their treatment of Al, both in their careers, and in the esteem of
> their fans...
>
> Well, I think that is a bit too simple of an answer, and we should also
> realize that we may be somewhat biased on our end.  First of all, I
> definitely believe that Al is a big part of BOC's success, and that
the
> music suffered greatly after he left.  But, it may be a stretch to assume
> that BOC never would've went anywhere had Al never been in the band -- it
> might have been much different, and possibly less successful, but
> non-existent?  I don't know about that.  However, I also believe that
> BOC's problems go way beyond what happened between individuals.  This
> band has been without Al (2 weeks in '85, and the Imaginos saga not
> withstanding) as a contributor for almost 15 years.  Has the band made
> no other mistakes since then other than the handling of Imaginos?  Can
> you say Club Ninja?  Can you say Cult Classic?  Can you say Workshop of
> the Telescopes? (which, btw I think the band should have overseen more
> and demanded a more quality product, especially in terms of the packaging)
> Can you say "we've got a new album coming out 'soon'"?  Can you say
> "we don't want to release our material independently"?  This band is
> certainly paying, but losing Al (and Joe) Bouchard is only part of the
> reason that this band is where they are at today (a big part, I do believe,
> but certainly there have been many more mistakes which followed).
>
Agreed, though it is easy to see that their major toubles started
after they shafted Al.  Maybe a little more than coincidence?


> As far as us being biased, well, we have to keep in mind that we get alot
> of our insight on some of this stuff from Al and Deb.  And, as Albert
> told me himself when I would ask for his input on some of this stuff
> for the FAQ, it is only part of the story, or only the story from his
> point of view.  I have no reason to doubt anything that Al and Deb have

Yes!  The maddening thing is that the rest of BOC never participate
in this forum and try to tell their side of the story.  Really, Al
could whine an awful lot more if he wanted to, and ascend the soapbox
whenever he felt like it--we're a captive audience.  But he usually
only offers stuff about the 'Imaginos' saga when someone poses a
specific question, and then is surprisingly free from personal
attacks.  This contributes to his credibility, I believe.
I wish the rest of them would get on BOC-L and tell us their side,
then we could decide for ourselves.

> told us, and in fact one of the reasons I have great respect for them
> is because of this statement Al made to me -- he realizes that there are
> 2 sides to a story, and he can not speak for other members of BOC.  We
> have to all understand that what happened between the members in question
> is not necessarily simple, and that all of the details may not be
> pleasant, and that (most importantly) they are none of our business.
>
Sure enough.  While I admire Al a lot [more sycophantic ass-kissing!]
it's likely he's done some bad shit to the rest of BOC over the years
as well.  I just think he's a little more--make that a lot more--up
front about it.  I've never heard of him trying to duck his
responsibility for the way things turned out.

theo>